MP: Yeah, that’s a really good question. Well, I started in the IT industry on the technology side now some 25 plus plus years ago, back when email first came around. Cut my teeth back in Australia. I’m originally from Adelaide, and cut my teeth on building enterprise email systems for the state government back home. Sort of worked my way through the technology side of things when voice over IP became a thing. Today, what we’re using with things like Zoom and Teams and Skype and all those types of interesting technologies that have become part of day-to-day life now, and really got involved in the real estate side of technology now probably five or six years ago when working with some clients that we’re looking to build new facilities, build new buildings, and really sort of worked out during those programs that the huge opportunity that laid in the real estate and workplace area around bringing technology in to help the experience of people in offices. So it’s kind of the short journey of where I’ve got to.

DA: Right, and then eventually led you to Accenture obviously.

MP: Yeah, so I’ve been at Accenture now for, I think this is going on to my ninth year. Came here to help continue to build the workplace practice in Accenture technology, and now have the pleasure of leading that in North America for both what we call our digital workplace practice, which is all around sort of end user technology and our intelligent workplace business, which is all around helping our clients implement technology in the build environment.

DA: Awesome. Well, I think your experience and what you do every day is going to be really valuable to our listeners. So why do you think you were so uniquely suited to this position? What has helped you to become successful, particularly having gone through so much transition before, during, and now after the pandemic? What has positioned you for success?

MP: Yeah, it’s a great question, and I’ve thought about this quite a bit over the last five or six years about like, why do I do what I do and why do I, more importantly, love what I do? And I’ve still been doing the same thing somewhat 25 years later. And I originally thought that it was about technology and that I like technology and I like what it was doing and how it helped people work. But really, what I’ve boiled it down to is I actually like the people side of it. I like using technology to help people do things better, faster, more efficiently, more effectively, and really making their lives easier. And so sort of where I’ve landed and why I’ve always been working in the tech side, that has to do with people. And again, the built environment and the workplace specifically has really pivoted now, it’s all about experience. It’s all about people in space and how can we, specifically in this post pandemic world, make workplaces that people love to work in, that they come to and they feel more efficient, more effective than they can be at home, that they can access services that are reliable. So I’ve kind of been really fortunate to land in the middle of this perfect storm where the market has been really demanding what it is that we’ve been talking about now for some five or six years.

DA: Yeah, I love that perspective. We’ve been saying, for a long time, certainly pre-pandemic, that the building really wasn’t the asset, it was the people in them that ultimately, buildings were just places for people. And it’s been all about the people from the beginning. And certainly, my history in working in commercial real estate has always been helping building operators connect to the people that use those spaces. So I love that perspective. It’s not technology for technology’s sake. It’s really how does it enable people to do what they need to do, right?

MP: Yeah, totally. I mean, when we look at the needs that an organization may have, whether it’s an occupier or a landlord, it’s all about, for us, the first question is, who are the people? Like what are they coming in? Why are they coming in? Why are they choosing to come in? Or why do they need to come in? What is the thing that they need to do in that space? And how can we use technology to streamline or automate or improve the use case that they’re choosing to come in for. And whether that’s finding a place to sit, getting entry to the building, getting in the right elevator to go to the floor, finding where it is that they need to sit, finding their friends, like anything like this that you go through your workday as a person in that space, is there a way that we can use technology to improve that, make it more efficient, make it a more pleasant experience, make it more valuable? And ultimately, for the organizations, it’s about making people more effective in the space.

DA: Agreed, agreed. I think we can both agree that commercial real estate has just gone through one of the most turbulent periods of time. Certainly, I can remember. Likely, you can remember. Now, commercial real estate is still the largest asset class in the world. It continues to rebound from this prolonged period of low levels of occupancy. And it’s still trying to figure out how it meets the emerging needs, as we’ve just discussed, of people. And at the same time, faced with the disruption of new technologies, that in terms of how it’s delivering spaces and service, certainly, exciting times for both of us.

MP: Oh, totally, totally.

DA: Our team really believes that now, buildings are really much part, they’re part of a larger workplace ecosystem and they’re certainly core to how building, sorry, how businesses operate. But we have to recognize that we need to stay connected to people no matter where they are. This is not a fad. This is likely going to continue for some time. We need to connect with them in the building when they’re in their dining room at their dining room table working, at a neighborhood co-working space, at a local cafe, wherever they might be. So I’m just curious, going to sort of tackle this sort of area from a few perspectives, but what are you seeing right now? How do you think the CRE industry is responding or reimagining its business as a result of sort of the reality of today?

MP: Yeah, that’s a really great question, David. And my honest answer is I think some parts of it are evolving more rapidly than others. I still feel like there are parts of it that maybe thinking or hoping that it may go back to the way that it was. And it’s definitely one of the things that excites me about the industry though is there’s so much opportunity for us to help make improvements in the way that the product space is offered and whether that’s the space of a landlord to a tenant, or whether that’s the space of a tenant to the people that go in there. But there’s definitely some parts of the ecosystem that are recognizing that, that are getting on board with it. I think that there’s still some interesting discussions and debate going on around co-working and how does that play into the equation. But I think for me, going back to having my centered thought process on people and what is it that they need to do, and to anchor off of your comment before about, how do we reach out to them wherever they are, it’s about building that, let’s call it a unified experience for the person, regardless of, now if I’m going to a co-working space, if I’m going to Starbucks, if I’m coming to my office, if I’m going to a satellite, if I’m going to my corporate headquarters, how do I just do the things that I need to do through a standard way? I don’t want to have to do it one way in one building and use another tool in another building, whether it’s booking space or getting on a Zoom meeting. Now, how do we provide them with a streamlined experience and capability to just do their work wherever it is that they’re going? And I think that that’s sort of the ultimate goal. And the industry has got some way to go, but I think that there’s definitely some people out there and some organizations out there that are the leading lights holding the torch at the moment. And ultimately, that the rest of the industry will come along. I was just listening the other day to an interview that the Chief Investment Officer from Hines gave, I think it was actually at Davos, and there’s this statistic out there that 90% of the people right now are looking for 10% of the space, right? Everyone’s looking for class A, class A+ space. And in that market, there’s so many ways that people can differentiate or even improve the services in these class B and class C facilities using technology. It’s not just about the floor space and where it’s located, but it’s also about the services that you as a landlord can provide to your tenants and to the people that are in them. So I think there’s some really exciting opportunities there as well to use technology to improve the attractiveness of tenant spaces as well.

DA: I agree. There’s so much talk about the flight to quality and maybe the death of the B and C building. I actually think that technology can be the great equalizer. I think that to your point, maybe they can’t offer all the amenities. Maybe they can’t offer the rooftop patio and some of the green spaces, but those B and C class buildings that can offer a more bespoke, more boutique, more personalized experience and perhaps can use technology to not only connect people within the building, but to the neighborhood, to the city and create that, as you said, that one stop shop to enable them to be effective in all that they’re doing, whether in the building or whether they’re around their building. That’s certainly what we’re thinking about an awful lot. And I think, again, there’s a great opportunity for those B and C not to sort of pack it in and think the end of their building has arrived, but really, how do they position themselves as a distinct option within the realm of what people are looking for today. And again, not everybody wants a 60-story building. Some people want that 10 story, very intimate, easy to get into, easy to get out of experience.

MP: Yeah, no, I totally agree, David. And I think that that’s one space that the traditional CRE market really hasn’t spent a lot of time, right? It’s says, how can I increase my price per square foot that I can charge based on the services that are available and not hard services, not, hey, there’s a gym or there’s a cafeteria, but how do I provide my tenants with either a tool set that their people can use, or even when you’re looking to attract larger tenants, big multinationals. It’s not just about the services that I’ve got in the building, but the services that I can make available to them, that I can publish to them via APIs and things like that, that they can choose to consume through their own standardized global workplace application. That’s an area that I’m really interested in right now. I think it’s an opportunity for someone to really crack into the market and say, “Hey, we’re going to start to offer this.” So exciting time. So much opportunity out there to change the way that products are sold and marketed and consumed.

DA: Absolutely, and again, to your point, it’s how they interconnect because we look at our platform, which obviously enables building operators to connect with their tenants no matter where they are. But then how do we maybe begin to embed some of the systems and processes that are actually used to manage the occupant space. Again, to your point, not everybody wants to have five apps through websites and two portals to do all that they need to do during their day, and to be able to sort of move seamlessly through all these different spaces. So it’s really greenfield in terms of really fracking this nut and exciting and certainly challenging, for sure.

MP: Yeah, totally. I mean, it’s one of those things. There’s still a lot that needs to change. Corporate real estate’s been doing what it’s been doing for way longer than my lifetime. But I think one of the interesting things in this space when it comes to technologies, in the technology side of things, we’re used to moving really quickly. We can churn things over in one or two years. Like even if I make an investment now, in two or three years, that those systems are retired or that infrastructure’s retired. In the CRE space, you’re talking two to three to sometimes four years from when an idea comes up to when it actually goes live, right? And the life cycle is so much longer. So even the things that we’re talking about today in helping clients and even some product vendors that we work with around how do they make the products that they’re putting into buildings more intelligent, there’s still a life cycle around educating the builders or the contractors that are out there, specifying these things to ask for technology-enabled platforms to go in there. And they don’t understand this part of the market either. They don’t understand what to ask for. They don’t understand what it means to have an IoT connected elevator, for example, right? And how does that play into experience of a tenant and how does that turn into an experience that the landlord can sell? So there’s a long way to go, I think, before we get these amazing buildings that can do all that we know is possible just due to the life cycle. But slowly but surely, more and more people are starting to understand that. We’re starting to see bits and pieces of buildings become a little bit more intelligent, a little bit more connected. I think we’re going to get, we’ll definitely get there, but it’s going to be a little bit of a slow road. The good thing is there’s so much real estate out there and there’s so many buildings out there. And the focus is on the market right now. So I think now is the time to be here and really make a difference for the future.

DA: Agreed. I’m just curious from your own practice. How closely are you seeing building owners and operators working with their customers, their occupiers, their tenants in terms of collaborating, partnering to address this new world where we’re looking to determine how do we attract and retain the best talent? How do we create experiences to bring people together and continue to build great companies? Is it still sort of, you work for real estate people and they’re over on this camp. You work for the occupier and they’re in this camp. Are you seeing any synergies between the two?

MP: Yeah, great question, David. I think the answer to that is not enough, right? Not enough. I still feel like we’re seeing the owner’s building a building and they pull out a set of specs that they’ve had for the last 5, 10, 15 years and they build a building, right? It’s got so much floor space, it’s going to have a great view, it’s going to have a gym. And I don’t necessarily know that I see them working with the tenants or the potential tenants and saying, “What do you need other than location?” And the CRE industry is great at picking the right location and transport and all the things that are traditional, but I don’t know that they’ve done a great job yet around what kind of digital services do you need in the building? I definitely see a lot of them making a call on their own and putting something in and then trying to sell it afterwards and saying, “Hey, we’ve got this thing. It’s great.” And then some tenants might say, “Hey, yeah, that’s great. We love that too.” And then others go, “That’s not really what we want, right? We want something a little different, or we need something a little bit more modular.” And that’s why I’ve been a huge advocate in this space of saying, “Don’t just give the tenants a product,” right? Don’t get there and say, “Here is a widget, or here is a website that you use to book the gym,” for example. Here’s a website you can use to book the gym, but here’s also a service that you can tap into, an API set or something like that, that allows you to consume that service through whatever way it is that you choose. And I think that gives the tenants a whole lot more flexibility around how they present that to their people, whether they brand it, whether they integrate it with some other company-wide platform. But there’s definitely a whole lot of opportunity in a pivoting to this, like digital services as opposed to a digital tool that I may or may not choose to care about.

DA: Right, so bottom line is more collaboration, more integration, a greater understanding as to what the needs are of your customer. And I think those conversations are, they’re starting, but there obviously need to be more of them.

MP: Yes, agree.

DA: I think a lot about buildings and we always have taken the view that buildings are not silos. They’re not simply four walls. They’re really an important and integral component of neighborhoods and cities. So we always like to think that we’ve got to think bigger. And I’m just curious from your perspective, do you think that workplaces can play a role in creating larger and more connected communities? What’s the opportunity in that mindset?

MP: Yeah, no, it’s like you’re reading my mind, David. And I promise everyone that’s listening to this, we did not rehearse this. So no, I totally agree. It’s another part of sort of my viewpoint and what I talk to our owner and landlord clients about how do you bring the services that are around the building into the building, right? Into and publish them to the tenants? How do you let them know what’s on special at their favorite Chinese restaurant down the street? How do you let them know about what’s happening with any sort of ride share or transport systems that are around the building? They may not be specific just for that one company, but they’re services that are available for them to consume in the neighborhood. I think it makes a huge amount of sense. It’s something that the occupiers, the tenants would love to be able to share to their own people. There’s value in building vibrant neighborhoods, especially at the moment where you go to some cities. And I was in San Francisco a couple of weeks ago. When you’re downtown San Francisco, it’s still so quiet, right? I don’t want to use the term, I don’t want to use the term “dead”, but it’s definitely really quiet. And how do we connect people that do come in to the services that are around and encourage them to go to their favorite coffee shop or tell them how long the line is at the Starbucks and things like that? Huge amount of opportunity. And I think that it’s something that I’ve seen done okay in some other parts of the world. I spent a number of years living in Singapore before moving to the US and it’s one of the things that they do really well in a number of facilities over there, where it’s pretty common to have food services and food courts in the basements of buildings, but don’t necessarily go beyond the services that are in the individual landlord’s tenancy. But definitely in places like New York City and Chicago and things like that, connecting people to the services that are around, from smaller businesses, from minority run businesses, and using technology to connect the community together I think is a huge opportunity.

DA: Well, we definitely feel the same way. That’s why we built our community directory within our platform right from the get-go. And again, all we saw are that buildings should not be just looked at as a silo, but really need to be thought of in a much broader context. And for particularly, the B and C buildings, it just further amenitizes the building, because we’re taking advantage of everything around us versus just what’s within those four walls. So totally agree, and I think there’s still a lot of opportunity that we have yet to realize, but we’re excited about continuing to explore that space. Let’s take a short break and we’ll be right back.

COMMERCIAL BREAK

DA: And now I’d like to welcome back to the show Michael Przytula, Managing Director, Intelligent & Digital Workplaces at Accenture. Once again, thank you so much for being with us today. I’m really enjoying our conversation.

MP: Likewise, likewise. So what have you got for me next, David?

DA: Well, right up your alley here. We’ve talked a lot about technology. Technology has obviously played a significant role in reshaping how building operators deliver great customer experience to their tenants. And workplace engagement now I think is uppermost in everyone’s mind and really I think presents a lot of opportunity to do things differently. So with the focus on meeting the evolving needs of people in buildings, what technologies are you seeing that are gaining traction and are really contributing to building that better experience?

MP: Yeah, it’s another great question. I think the hot topic of debate and discussion across the board right now are two things, right? Number one, we’re definitely seeing a lot of people interested in like what does room and desk reservation look like? The vast majority of companies, I think, have made the decision to, if not go hoteling or free address or whatever words you want to use for it, flexible seating for the vast majority of their portfolios, there’s still some pockets where they’re deciding if somebody’s committed to go onto a three day or a four day a week plan that they may give them a dedicated desk, but the vast majority is going to some sort of free addressing or hoteling situation. And so giving people the comfort that when they come in, that they know where they’re going to sit, they’re going to be sitting near their colleagues or their friends or the people that they need to work with for the day. So that’s one concern. The other one that we’re definitely seeing that this type of system is being used to address is just the demand for collaborative space. That’s something that’s gone through the roof with people choosing to come back for mainly that reason. And organizations that haven’t got a platform that allows them to reserve those or or book them are really clamoring for a solution to make sure that when people do choose to do the commute, to come in, especially now through the winter and things like that, that there is a space available for them to do the things that they have actively chosen to come in to do. So booking or reservation systems is definitely one. The other one which is generally seen as a little bit more on the operation side, but has a tie into all of this is there still continues to be huge interest and demand around sensors and how do we put sensors into spaces, what should we measure? How should we measure? It’s a little bit more of a tricky scenario because there’s so many different things to understand, there’s so many different things to measure. There’s technical challenges around, do we have to run cables, do we have to have wireless? What is the thing that we even care about measuring? And a lot of organizations are still going through trying to understand what that is. So they’re probably the two hottest ones that we see across the board right now that people are going through and trying to figure out.

DA: Right, makes sense. Do you think there’s anything that is sort of reactive and more fad-like versus what is going to be more permanent and sustainable? Are you seeing anything that’s sort of, people are reacting quickly, but it’s probably only really going to be needed for a short period of time or maybe not needed at all?

MP: Yeah, I think we’ve kind of past that point now. If you’d asked me this 12 months ago, I probably would’ve said yes. There was definitely still a lot of focus around capacity management, not necessarily monitoring, but how do we make sure that no more than 50 people come in and how do we make sure that no more than four people are in a room? How do we make sure that we’re tracking who’s coming in so that we can advise if there’s been a COVID sort of alert or exposure? And I think now that we’ve settled into this period where most organizations have got a vision for the future within some degree of tolerance, that it’s a tolerance that they’re ready to commit to, they’re making longer term decisions on what the future’s going to look like for them, whether it’s footprint consolidation, moving to disposing of space, subletting space, what their future occupancy’s going to look like, how often are people going to come in, things like that. And so they’re ready to make those longer term commitments for the infrastructure and the technology that they’re going to need to support the way that their people have chosen to consume the office or the platforms that they’re going to need to operate the spaces in the way that they see their footprint looking in the future.

DA: Right. Before we get to our closing speed round, just because I want to tap into what you’re seeing right now with your huge view into the industry, what are your clients asking for and what are they doing? Are they looking for new space? Are they reducing their footprint? Are they taking their existing and re-imagining, to your point, creating more collaborative spaces? Like what’s the major trend you are seeing right now in the industry? One significant purpose of this podcast is provide a real-time view into what’s going on. Not a prediction of what’s going to happen 6 months or 12 months, but hey everybody, do you want to know what’s going on? Tune into the TEN Experience Podcast. So what are you seeing today?

MP: Yeah, no, right now, and I think we touched on this just briefly before we started, but I’m really seeing people are in that consolidation planning stage right now. They have a vision for what the future looks like. Most organizations have got some form of what their long-term remote work or flexible working or whatever their program is called is going to look like. CRE right now is going through the, okay, what does this mean for our footprint? What do we keep, what do we dispose of? And it’s sort of an optimize and reinvent phase. So what things are we going to dispose of and then which ones are we going to keep and how are we going to reinvest in them? That’s sort of the stage that I’m seeing people at right now as of today.

DA: Great, okay. Closing speed round, an opportunity to get to know you, Michael, a little bit better. What do you enjoy doing when you’re not at work?

MP: What do I enjoy doing when I’m not at work? I’m a ultra distance cyclist, so I like to get on my bike and ride really far for a number of days on end. The furthest away I can get, the happier I am.

DA: And literally ride all day, like you’re riding all day, all night?

MP: Yeah.

DA: Wow. Well, I am a rider, but not to that degree. So talk riding on another call. What is your drink of choice? Hot, cold, alcoholic, not alcoholic?

MP: My drink of choice. In the mornings, it’s definitely some sort of juice or smoothie of some description, but I’ll have to say I’m definitely a tequila person in the evening.

DA: Alright, good to keep in mind. What’s your favorite movie or current TV series that you’re watching?

MP: I don’t know about watching right now, but I think pretty relevant to the audience here, if people haven’t watched it yet, I’m going to be surprised, but I’m going to highly recommend you watch it. I thought “WeCrashed” was phenomenal. I’ve got a lot of respect for the work that WeWork did very early on and the vision that they had for the market. And so it was a really fascinating mini-series to watch. The acting was phenomenal, but just the story was great as well to sort of see it so brought to life. So yeah, I’m going to say “WeCrashed”.

DA: Great, thank you. And one way in which technology has improved how you live or work.

MP: Oh, that’s a great one. Definitely, the technology that we’ve been using over the last couple years, I mentioned in my introduction, I’ve been working in this space for my whole life in this sort of remote working, video conferencing on the PC, making phone calls from the PC, and I’ve been working like this for 15 years now. So that, for me, has really been the fundamental thing is it’s the ability to do what I do from anywhere, anytime. And I think that now it’s become mainstream. When we started doing this type of thing, people were really confused about, how am I going to use my computer to make a telephone call? Like that’s never going to happen. And no one’s ever going to use video conferencing on their PC. They need to buy a hundred thousand dollar room set up to do that kind of thing. So that’s really been, for me, the thing that’s revolutionized the way that I work, but also, been fortunate enough to ride the wave professionally as well.

DA: You’ve been embedded right in it. What’s your personal choice for days spent in person working with your colleagues versus working from anywhere?

MP: So I travel quite a bit, so I don’t really, I live in Austin, Texas, but I very rarely get into our actual office in Austin. But definitely, when I’m traveling, I like to get my team together in the office, bring everyone together. It’s definitely a collaboration type thing. I’m never a sort of go to the office to sit down and do any sort of focus work type people or person. So if I’m in New York, or last week I was in Tampa, getting the team together for one or two days while I’m there, sitting down, working on the whiteboard, bringing people in collaboratively that can’t be there. But it’s really the culture and the relationships thing that I enjoy about and the reason that I go into the offices when I do.

DA: Makes sense. Michael, thank you so much for joining me today on the program. I really enjoyed the conversation. I’ve learned a lot and I’m looking forward to continuing to dialogue about all that we do within commercial real estate, both for the building operator and owner as well as the occupier. I think 2023 is going to be a breakout year, and a lot of what you and I do I think is going to be super relevant. So I’m looking forward to staying connected.

MP: Likewise, David. Thank you so much for having me here and look forward to speaking to you again soon.

DA: Take care now. I want to thank Michael Przytula for joining me on this episode of TEN and for contributing to the global conversation around buildings, being a part of a robust ecosystem helping to build great companies, and that they’re vital in the effort to cultivate and support great people and teams. The future of the workplace will likely take many forms, and we’ll continue to explore what that looks like together. Subscribe to TEN for more conversations with leading CRE industry professionals and experts who all have something to say about tenant experience and the future of the workplace. We love hearing from you. So if you enjoyed this episode of TEN, please share, add your rating, and review us through your preferred podcast provider. 

If you or someone you know would like to be a guest on a future episode, please reach out to me directly at david@hiloapp.com. And until our next episode, I wish you all continued success in building community where you work and live, thank you.